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Thread: The Pinball Arcade Is On Its Way To The Windows 8 Marketplace!!!

  1. #51
    Member seattlemark's Avatar
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    I think this is great news! I hope that in this TPA on Win8 they enable XBOX Controllers (like Pinball FX2 supports under Win8). Flipperwise, I find it much easier to use the triggers on the XBOX controller when I play Pinball FX2 on my Windows 8 desktop PC, than using my Kindle Fire tablet's glass for the flippers buttons in TBA. Same is true for the nudge. As far as the picture, I use my monitor (and sometimes my TV) with the Fire on TPA and with the Win8 PC on PBFX2. Although I think the picture from Windows 8 with PBFX2 is benefiting because my graphics adapter on my desktop PC is a lot more powerful than on my Fire.
    Last edited by seattlemark; 03-03-2013 at 10:49 AM.

  2. #52
    Nik Barbour
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    Re: The Pinball Arcade Is On Its Way To The Windows 8 Marketplace!!!

    http://pinballarcadefans.com/showthr...6813#post56813

    If Zen for Win8 is anything to go by, TPA for win8 will almost definitely (I'm not positive, but very nearly) be a scaled mobile version for PC, similar to the current TPA for Mac version.

    The TZ PC beta Sean played will almost certainly be a derivative of the full Windows version which cannot get greenlight on Steam.
    Not the same animal at all.

    Zen for Win8 is a ghastly shadow of its console counterpart, and is not even as good as the Android version!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Nik Barbour View Post
    http://pinballarcadefans.com/showthr...6813#post56813

    Zen for Win8 is a ghastly shadow of its console counterpart, and is not even as good as the Android version!
    no need for any FUD. maybe the guy didn't turn up the higher graphical settings. they are all at the lowest settings by default when you first purchase it. apparently, the reason is that the game is extremely buggy with various versions of Nvidia drivers. some people have had to fall back on older Nvidia drivers to get the higher graphical settings enabled.

    luckily for me, I have ATI/AMD and the game looks beautiful.

  4. #54
    Nik Barbour
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    Re: The Pinball Arcade Is On Its Way To The Windows 8 Marketplace!!!

    Quote Originally Posted by dirtyvu View Post
    turn up the higher graphical settings.
    I turned them to max, but it looked flat and matte, but even more importantly, the game play didn't feel fluid. (this was the free table - Mars).

    I'll admit it's not the greatest spec laptop, but it's not bad.

    Be interested to see some screen shots off your system.

    I guess no one knows fully what it will be like till it releases. I certainly want to try it.

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    From Facebook:
    We are submitting for Windows 8 very soon. We plan to be on all windows 8 devices through it's marketplace.
    Great!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Nik Barbour View Post
    Be interested to see some screen shots off your system.
    here's star wars on my 1080x1920 vertical monitor (I have a 3 monitor setup for my main desktop: 1920x1080, 1600x1200, and 1080x1920):


    bloom, reflections, and transparencies never show effectively in a static shot but even then, it's still able to be shown in the screen caps. there's no way that the console version is "better by a lot" over the PC version. The controls are the same (using an Xbox 360 controller on the PC), the framerate is the same (60 fps).

    here's star wars on the Xbox 360 (I captured it myself):

    this is the closest camera angle on the 360 to my preferred view on the PC

    anyway, this talk is way off-topic. I'm excited about The Pinball Arcade because it has the tables I played with as a kid. As much as I like Pinball FX2 (and I have quite a few tables on the 360 and now the PC), I like the old tables more. I think the design of pinball is better. Don't want to turn this into a TPA vs Pinball FX2 argument either but if I had to pick one, I'd pick TPA for its classic tables.

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    Member seattlemark's Avatar
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    Re: The Pinball Arcade Is On Its Way To The Windows 8 Marketplace!!!

    A couple of issues that are happening with the current Zen Studios Pinball FX2 implementation on Windows 8, which I hope that FarSight can avoid with TPA when FarSight goes on Win 8.
    #1). In Win 8 version, there are no demos/trials of non-purchased PBFX2 tables (other than the free Mars table that comes with the base download of the game).
    #2). In Win 8 version, you must have an internet connection to get to your profile in "XBOX Games" before you can start up any but the free Mars PBFX2 table. If no internet connection, the tables that you have already purchased become limited time trials until you can get back to the internet.

    When I inquired about the internet connection issue of #2 above, three weeks ago I learned from a Zen Studios employee in their forum that this issue is being worked on but they did not know yet when Win 8 users would have the ability to play offline. Some other Zen forum members said that it has something to do with DRM and may involve Microsoft too. This issue, I was told by the Zen forum users, is not happening with the XB0X 360 console. So ironically an XBOX 360 console (that tends to be stationary in the home) does NOT require the internet connection to play PBFX2, while a portable Windows 8 tablet (which often leaves the home) DOES require the Internet to play PBFX2. (And not everyone has a data plan for use outside the home on their tablets, and not everyone is near a wireless hotspot outside the home.)

    Regarding the issue #1 involving lack of PBFX2 demos before purchase, I have heard from other forum users that it's also specific to the Win 8 implementation and also may have to do with the DRM on this Zen Studios game. The demos are a fantastic part of FarSight's TPA and helps with purchase decisions, and I sincerely hope demos can remain when TPA goes to Win 8.

    On the plus side, Pinball FX2 provides the ability to use an XBOX 360 controller in its Windows 8 implementation (in addition to keyboard and touch window). As I mentioned in an earlier post in this thread, the ability to use an XBOX360 controller is a huge benefit to Win 8 desktop users of PBFX2 under Win8, and I hope Farsight can do the same with The Pinball Arcade under Windows 8.
    Last edited by seattlemark; 03-03-2013 at 10:44 AM.

  8. #58
    Nik Barbour
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    Re: The Pinball Arcade Is On Its Way To The Windows 8 Marketplace!!!

    Quote Originally Posted by dirtyvu View Post
    here's star wars on my 1080x1920 vertical monitor
    I've got to concede it looks great on your rig.

    That probably means TPA win 8 will be a no go for me also then (stoopid Nvidea piece of cr@p).

    Ho hum - I'm happy Nexus 7'ing.

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    Member seattlemark's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nik Barbour View Post
    I've got to concede it looks great on your rig. ... stoopid Nvidea ....
    Like dirtyvu, I am using an AMD/ATI graphics adapter. My picture with that setup with Pinball FX2 is excellent using my desktop PC, when connected via HDMI to either my monitor or to my TV. That, plus I really hope XBOX 360 Controller support, are reasons that I can't wait for TPA on Win 8. (I would have been happy with Win 7 for either game too since I am running Win 8 in a Virtual Machine on a Win 7 desktop PC, with pinball my inspiration for even trying Windows 8 for the first time.)
    Last edited by seattlemark; 03-03-2013 at 12:09 PM.

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    Senior Member superballs's Avatar
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    Re: The Pinball Arcade Is On Its Way To The Windows 8 Marketplace!!!

    Quote Originally Posted by dirtyvu View Post
    here's star wars on my 1080x1920 vertical monitor (I have a 3 monitor setup for my main desktop: 1920x1080, 1600x1200, and 1080x1920):


    bloom, reflections, and transparencies never show effectively in a static shot but even then, it's still able to be shown in the screen caps. there's no way that the console version is "better by a lot" over the PC version. The controls are the same (using an Xbox 360 controller on the PC), the framerate is the same (60 fps).

    here's star wars on the Xbox 360 (I captured it myself):

    this is the closest camera angle on the 360 to my preferred view on the PC

    anyway, this talk is way off-topic. I'm excited about The Pinball Arcade because it has the tables I played with as a kid. As much as I like Pinball FX2 (and I have quite a few tables on the 360 and now the PC), I like the old tables more. I think the design of pinball is better. Don't want to turn this into a TPA vs Pinball FX2 argument either but if I had to pick one, I'd pick TPA for its classic tables.
    I'm quite impressed. I'm more onterested in how it will all run on my now quite modest laptop.
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  11. #61
    Nik Barbour
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    Re: The Pinball Arcade Is On Its Way To The Windows 8 Marketplace!!!

    Quote Originally Posted by superballs View Post
    I'm quite impressed. I'm more onterested in how it will all run on my now quite modest laptop.
    I don't want to jinx you - but I think mine's a write off.
    Zen win8 sucks on Nvidia.
    Glass half full - TPA might be wonderful.

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    Senior Member superballs's Avatar
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    Re: The Pinball Arcade Is On Its Way To The Windows 8 Marketplace!!!

    Mines a 2ghz core2 duo with an ati radeon hd2600 pro mobile. No slouch in its time but it's time is not now.
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    Quote Originally Posted by seattlemark View Post
    #2). In Win 8 version, you must have an internet connection to get to your profile in "XBOX Games" before you can start up any but the free Mars PBFX2 table. If no internet connection, the tables that you have already purchased become limited time trials until you can get back to the internet.
    yeah, there's no reason Pinball FX2 should require an Internet connection. there are many Windows Store games that do not require an Internet connection so this must be the DRM implementation that Zen Studios wanted or chose. hopefully they fix it.

    also agree about the inability to try out the tables in the Windows 8 version. this doesn't make sense. practically all the Windows Store apps have trial modes. heck, I know a lot of people that get by with the trial mode for many apps (as Windows 8 is very lenient and practically lets you use the trial mode indefinitely so it's almost more of a shareware "honor system" than a true trial mode).

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    Member seattlemark's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by dirtyvu View Post
    yeah, there's no reason Pinball FX2 should require an Internet connection. there are many Windows Store games that do not require an Internet connection so this must be the DRM implementation that Zen Studios wanted or chose. hopefully they fix it.

    also agree about the inability to try out the tables in the Windows 8 version. this doesn't make sense. practically all the Windows Store apps have trial modes....

    I just hope that FarSight Studios doesn't wind up with the same two problems.
    Here are what a couple of Zen Studios forum members had said last month, after I initially asked if I had a bug or not with Pinball FX2 under Windows 8:


    Person 1's response to me: Yes, you need an internet connection to play purchased tables. It's not a bug; it's a huge design flaw. Though I could not say if Zen Studios or Microsoft is to blame.

    Person 2's response to Person 1: It's kinda of both. When the game was in development, MS only had that DRM option available. After the game released, MS decided to lift their DRM policy on games. Zen is working on a fix, but I don't know when it will release.


    Person 1's response to me: Likewise, the free "trial game" option is only available after purchasing the table, which makes it completely useless. That one is probably Zen's fault.

    Person 2's response to Person 1: Nope! This is Microsoft's fault. The feature is available in Zen's other platforms as well, but currently Windows 8 doesn't support it.
    Last edited by seattlemark; 03-03-2013 at 06:58 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by seattlemark View Post
    I just hope that FarSight Studios doesn't wind up with the same two problems.
    Here are what a couple of Zen Studios forum members had said last month, after I initially asked if I had a bug or not with Pinball FX2 under Windows 8:


    Person 1's response to me: Yes, you need an internet connection to play purchased tables. It's not a bug; it's a huge design flaw. Though I could not say if Zen Studios or Microsoft is to blame.

    Person 2's response to Person 1: It's kinda of both. When the game was in development, MS only had that DRM option available. After the game released, MS decided to lift their DRM policy on games. Zen is working on a fix, but I don't know when it will release.


    Person 1's response to me: Likewise, the free "trial game" option is only available after purchasing the table, which makes it completely useless. That one is probably Zen's fault.

    Person 2's response to Person 1: Nope! This is Microsoft's fault. The feature is available in Zen's other platforms as well, but currently Windows 8 doesn't support it.
    honestly, I read that and it seems that neither has a clue and both are just conjectures. all you can go by is what you see with your own 2 eyes. there are plenty of Windows Store games that don't require an Internet connection (I have yet to run into one that does need it). So you can make your own judgment on what happened. Also, other games have true trial modes so I don't understand why Pinball FX2 doesn't. Both problems are correctable and if Zen doesn't correct them, they'll lose a lot of sales.

    I see tons of apps, even free ones, get updated constantly. Heck, I have the Star Wars Almanac app and that's completely free (created by a fan), and it's updated so often, it's insane. No commercial app gets updated as much as this free one.

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    Moderator Sean DonCarlos's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by seattlemark View Post
    On the plus side, Pinball FX2 provides the ability to use an XBOX 360 controller in its Windows 8 implementation (in addition to keyboard and touch window). As I mentioned in an earlier post in this thread, the ability to use an XBOX360 controller is a huge benefit to Win 8 desktop users of PBFX2 under Win8, and I hope Farsight can do the same with The Pinball Arcade under Windows 8.
    I've not seen or otherwise been involved in the forthcoming Windows 8 version of TPA, but the PC beta for Twilight Zone that I tested a while back (on Windows 7) had 360 controller support.
    See the Lost in the Zone blog for my high score list, as well as more opinion, commentary, and observations on both physical and virtual pinball.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Nik Barbour View Post
    I don't want to jinx you - but I think mine's a write off.
    Zen win8 sucks on Nvidia.
    Glass half full - TPA might be wonderful.
    if you don't like the situation, you need to let Nvidia hear about it. pinball fans are a small group but they can be vocal like other groups. Tomb Raider is really terrible with Nvidia cards right now and their fans are in an uproar. And it's reached all the mainstream gaming sites. Nvidia immediately responded and said they're working feverishly to fix the problems. Yet nobody is publicizing how Pinball FX2 is buggy with Nvidia because the fanbase is too small or not vocal enough.

  18. #68
    Nik Barbour
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    Re: The Pinball Arcade Is On Its Way To The Windows 8 Marketplace!!!

    Quote Originally Posted by dirtyvu View Post
    if you don't like the situation, you need to let Nvidia hear about it.
    Thanks but.... - I'm happy with Android for my Pinball and MAME gaming fixes.
    I was just 'new laptop' curious really.

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    Moderator shutyertrap's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by dirtyvu View Post
    if you don't like the situation, you need to let Nvidia hear about it. pinball fans are a small group but they can be vocal like other groups. Tomb Raider is really terrible with Nvidia cards right now and their fans are in an uproar. And it's reached all the mainstream gaming sites. Nvidia immediately responded and said they're working feverishly to fix the problems. Yet nobody is publicizing how Pinball FX2 is buggy with Nvidia because the fanbase is too small or not vocal enough.
    I'm playing Tomb Raider right now with an Nvidia card and it looks great! My processor isn't powerful enough to handle the graphix cranked up on hair (literally benchmarked at 19 fps with hair on, 65 with hair off!) and what I heard was the tessellation is what Nvidia cards are having issues with (but again, my system can't handle that anyways).

    I do know that with Zen, I can't run Pinball FX2 in high res, it just crashes.
    I'm just sayin'

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    Senior Member esp2000's Avatar
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    Can't wait to buy this on the Windows 8 marketplace. I just wish that they had cross platform support on the stores between the Windows 8 store and the Windows Phone 8 store. That would be great.

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    Quote Originally Posted by shutyertrap View Post
    I'm playing Tomb Raider right now with an Nvidia card and it looks great! My processor isn't powerful enough to handle the graphix cranked up on hair (literally benchmarked at 19 fps with hair on, 65 with hair off!) and what I heard was the tessellation is what Nvidia cards are having issues with (but again, my system can't handle that anyways).

    I do know that with Zen, I can't run Pinball FX2 in high res, it just crashes.
    yeah, that's the joy of trying to program software for so many different PC configurations. programmers make their games based on their development PCs and the hardware and drivers that they have on-hand. they program to the high level API and depend on ATI, Nvidia, Intel, etc. to implement those API calls correctly.

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    Senior Member superballs's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by dirtyvu View Post
    yeah, that's the joy of trying to program software for so many different PC configurations. programmers make their games based on their development PCs and the hardware and drivers that they have on-hand. they program to the high level API and depend on ATI, Nvidia, Intel, etc. to implement those API calls correctly.
    Sounds more like "that's the problem with hardware manufacturers not implementing standard apis correctly"

    The whole point of having a standardized API like DX is to prevent this very thing. Sad thing is that Microsoft and Windows tend to get most of the blame on the basis that Windows98 was an unstable piece of junk.
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    that's the thing with drivers. these graphics card companies are in an arms race and release video cards so quickly. and it takes a few revisions before a solid driver comes out with the card. but then they can make changes which break things in previous driver revisions. and before they get it fully right, they're on to the next generation of graphics cards.

    yes, the point of standard APIs is to make programming easier. you write that you want to add 1+1 to DirectX (just a concepts example). your Nvidia/ATI card has to take that instruction and make a calculation from it. so it's like the English guy is sending a message to the translator and that translator delivers the exact same message to a pair of Spanish guys. and each Spanish guy can interpret and execute that exact same message differently and produce a slightly different result. So it's up to getting each Spanish guy to handle the message in exactly the same way. and that's the role of AMD/ATI or Nvidia. getting their graphics card to produce the correct result.

    right now, the great programmers have to take into account the unique characteristics of each card to avoid each card's "problems" even though standard APIs are supposed to solve that problem. if you have an ATI card, follow this path. if you have an Nvidia card, follow this path. that's the allure of consoles and mobile devices. very limited sets of hardware that you know all the faults that can be avoided.

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    Senior Member esp2000's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by seattlemark View Post
    I think this is great news! I hope that in this TPA on Win8 they enable XBOX Controllers (like Pinball FX2 supports under Win8). Flipperwise, I find it much easier to use the triggers on the XBOX controller when I play Pinball FX2 on my Windows 8 desktop PC, than using my Kindle Fire tablet's glass for the flippers buttons in TBA. Same is true for the nudge. As far as the picture, I use my monitor (and sometimes my TV) with the Fire on TPA and with the Win8 PC on PBFX2. Although I think the picture from Windows 8 with PBFX2 is benefiting because my graphics adapter on my desktop PC is a lot more powerful than on my Fire.
    I really hope they have the Xbox 360 controller support as well. I bought a controller this weekend for plaing PFX2 while I hooked my laptop up to my TV through the HDMI output and it was great. If this is done this way then I will be buying all of the tables again for sure.

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    Looking forward to this - Surface RT ready......

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